Peasant Weapon Combat

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Roger N
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Peasant Weapon Combat

Post by Roger N » Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:52 pm

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Re: Peasant Weapon Combat

Post by Shay Roberts » Sat Dec 26, 2009 6:09 pm

Those sickles are wicked looking. I wonder how difficult they are to withdraw from a target. Has anybody used these? Do they get stuck?
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Re: Peasant Weapon Combat

Post by Sternis » Sun Dec 27, 2009 11:46 am

That peasant staff reminded me a lot of Jogo do Pau.
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Re: Peasant Weapon Combat

Post by Frederico Martins » Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:45 am

I know what you mean with similarity in look, but that kind of bind in the beginning would be impossible in jogo do pau.
The power generated from jogo do pau strikes doesn't ever end like that, the hands would not be separated like in the image and a good jogo do pau staff fighter would never put himself in that position.

the other stuff looks much more similar no doubt, but done without any bio mechanical nuances that give the real value to it, and are what are so hard to pass and learn from text.

That is a great work in doing what is described there, unfortunately i believe that what isn't described is the most important in staff fighting. And even with the effort of the master that wrote this and your effort in recreation, it's unreachable this way. As it is still today to write a text to explain that kind of stuff.

I don't want to offend anyone or sound to propagandistic, this is really what I believe in, and I really respect this kind of work and research.
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Re: Peasant Weapon Combat

Post by Roger N » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:04 am

I think part of the difference lies in the fact that the branches they use are quite heavy and thus very slow and hard to control with proper circular strikes, compared to JdP staffs. They are basically used with regular longsword techniques; zornhau (wrath cut), schrankhut (barrier guard) and schnappen (snapping):

The attacker cuts with a zornhau. The defendant moves into schrankhut and uses the momentum to snap around with a zornhau from the other side, the attacker moves into schrankhut and does the same. Instead of schrankhut, upper hengen (hanging point) could also be used, very much like how we practiced basic JdP at Swordfish or as we have done in longsword practice. The "ready stance" however is quite different in JdP and more akin to Alber (fool's guard).

Also, as I have said earlier, I find the sections on peasant weapons in Mair's manuscript curious and I wonder how much this was actually practiced and performed. I get the feeling that Mair wanted to include absolutely everything pointy or blunt, including small trees, scythes and sickles. Branches and sickles seem logical, but perhaps not as likely to be practiced with as much as other more effective weapons.

This clip springs to mind. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RKTSwAVaoU

Much more interesting in my opinion, is Mair's section on the short staff. David James Knight, who is a member here, has written an excellent translation which you can find here http://www.amazon.co.uk/Polearms-Paulus ... 538&sr=8-1

Mair's short staff would be great to compare with various local variations of JdP. The Acores seems to have a slightly different style and from what I understand there are different variations depending on what region of Portugal we look at. Are these styles documented somehow?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFElG8r_d4o

Also, Joachim Meyer's quarterstaff would be interesting to compare. Jeffrey Forgeng has made a great translation that you can find here: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Combat-Germ ... 749&sr=8-1

Of course, the originals can be found at this site and I will be uploading more material soon.
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Re: Peasant Weapon Combat

Post by Frederico Martins » Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:23 am

yes, the kind of weapon changes alot the mechanics of the combat. I can't go deep into comparison since I don't know of all those styles. Someone already told me about that book, im getting curious:)

Azores is an island, when master Nuno Russo studied jogo do pau around Portugal I don't think he went there, but i know he sparred with people from there. I don't know much more than those videos too, but they fight in a more flourished way, very fast and amazing for demonstrations.
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